Studio Fire

[Michael Stoddard]

Sunday afternoon when I got home from church I had 4 or 5 frantic messages on my phone about a fire at our studio. I still don't think I'm going to become one of the people that brings their cell phone to church. My first thought, as you might expect, was the furnace. On my way to the studio I found out on the phone that the blaze started next to a pottery kiln in the back of the studio. It consumed a wood table and some coldworking (beveling) equipment. It spread to the ceiling and started the rafters up. The fire department busted a hole in the ceiling and started dumping water in, which shortly caused the drywall ceiling to collapse. When I got there Treavor had just finished scooping the glass out of the furnace. We didn't know how long the gas and electrc were going to be off, so scooping seems like the right move. A while after I had been there we got an electrician and plumber out to isolate the power and gas from the damaged area and we were able to get the furnace back up that night. Recharged the glass Monday and blew today. All we lost in the hot shop was about 120 pounds of glass and half of our Sunday afternoon. The stained glass shop was mostly damaged from the smoke and water. I don't think any major windows broke. About half the stained glass shop, which is about a quarter the building will have to be completely rebuilt. They're still trying to figure out exactly what it was that caused the thing.

I thought you might be interested to hear about this. Maybe a reminder could keep this from happening to someone else. Even though this was a pottery kiln it could have easily been an annealer or fusing kiln or furnace. I know I'll be keeping a closer eye on the electric and moving combustibles far away from the hot stuff.

[Scott Dunahee]

glad to hear that everything is mostly okay. That kind of scare will wake you up, for sure. This is probably a good reminder to us all to make sure our setups are safe. We all get so used to having fire around all the time that we may all at times get a little careless.

BSD

[Brian Blanthorn]

Sunday afternoon when I got home from church I had 4 or 5 frantic messages on my phone about a fire at our studio. I still don't think I'm going to become one of the people that brings their cell phone to church. My first thought, as you might expect, was the furnace. On my way to the studio I found out on the phone that the blaze started next to a pottery kiln in the back of the studio. It consumed a wood table and some coldworking (beveling) equipment. It spread to the ceiling and started the rafters up. The fire department busted a hole in the ceiling and started dumping water in, which shortly caused the drywall ceiling to collapse. When I got there Treavor had just finished scooping the glass out of the furnace. We didn't know how long the gas and electrc were going to be off, so scooping seems like the right move. A while after I had been there we got an electrician and plumber out to isolate the power and gas from the damaged area and we were able to get the furnace back up that night. Recharged the glass Monday and blew today. All we lost in the hot shop was about 120 pounds of glass and half of our Sunday afternoon. The stained glass shop was mostly damaged from the smoke and water. I don't think any major windows broke. About half the stained glass shop, which is about a quarter the building will have to be completely rebuilt. They're still trying to figure out exactly what it was that caused the thing.

I thought you might be interested to hear about this. Maybe a reminder could keep this from happening to someone else. Even though this was a pottery kiln it could have easily been an annealer or fusing kiln or furnace. I know I'll be keeping a closer eye on the electric and moving combustibles far away from the hot stuff.

Sorry 2 hear of ur fire hope U recover soon

A local glass blower had an arson atack

The fire was not 2 bad but the fire brigade proceded 2 put the "fire" out by pooring gallons of water on2 the furnace ( the fire was no where near the furnace )

Worce still that the owner was investigated as prime suspect and one one else was looked 4

Eventually the police decided that he was not a fault but by that time the real culprit was not looked 4

A sorry tale, especially here on the Island where U would hope the police would looked at other investigative avenues as well

Hope ur story turns out a lot better

Brian

[Pete VanderLaan]

I keep track of known studio fires Michael. Can you be any more specific as to why it happened? Was the kiln electric? Was it too close to combustibles? Was it bad housekeeping? Was it wiring? Was it a case of it being too hot for too long in one space?

Most importantly, did you learn anything about how to prevent another one? I used to swear that our studio would never go up because of the furnace but that MB's hot plate for coffee that was always covered with paper would take us all out.

At one point when I was Fire Chief , I was in my office in Santa Fe and MB called me on the phone and whispered that the studio was on fire. I don't still know why she was whispering but I suggested that the next time it would be better to dial 911 and to not call me at work. Then I called out a first due team on my handheld. It turned out to be more smoke damage than a fire since a 6" flue pipe had come disconnected on a woodstove. A number of years later we did have a fire with some combustibles under the hood but the building was non combustible and the ventilation system removed any and all smoke so no damage was done.

In the fire service, they call things that you bring into the building "live load" and it is why the fire department keeps wanting to inspect you. They know human nature pretty well. The building itself was probably deemed acceptable and up to code when it was built but the stuff you want to bring in can get pretty exciting. Imagine if you had had a portable propane torch back in the fire area.

I appreciate the information.

[Eben Horton]

I had a fire last year. I didn't feel the need to publicly embarrass myself, but pete's post makes me think I should mention it so that someone else may learn from it.

My studio has concrete floors and I use rubber kitchen mats in front of my marver, in between my bench and g-hole and at that point i had one where i stand when I gather at my furnace. One night, my drain port blew out and about 15 lbs of glass leaked out onto the floor and hit the mat- it smoldered a while and someone walking by my studio saw it and called the fire dept. no damage, except my pride..

So if you have mats on your floor, dont leave one in front of your furnace if you have a drain port

[Scott Novota]

One thing is for sure I walked straight out into the shop and moved a couple of things. Not that there was an issue but it made me want to get some more distance between my furnace and anything else in the shop.

Would putting a "levee" around you furnace in case of a pot rupture be a good idea. Mine sits at about a 1 1/2 degree angle so I know where it would run. I have mulled over the idea just as a safeguard to build a little catch out of brick just to be safe.

I had a pot crack and leak but not out of the furnace because I caught it in time. I have been thinking about this none stop from that day I cleaned out the bottom of the furnace.

What do you guys think? Or is this just a dumb idea.


Scott.
.

[Greg Frankhouser]

Hey Scott, my only first thought would be the effect of the hot glass on the foundation of the furnace. It you had it on a steel frame, would the hot glass cause more problems, maybe collapsing the whole shebang?

Greg F

[Pete VanderLaan]

Drain blowouts can be major issues. I have had drains blow that had accumulated over 250 lbs of glass over very long periods of time. When the Hydrostatic pressure became great enough and the furnace had been in high fire overnight on a particularly difficult chrome melt, It dumped that load and melted down two natural gas manometers. It also fried the gas solenoid which shut down the action when it failed.

Scary.

Don't ever leave anything in front of your drain and make sure your gas controls are totally protected from the unanticipated.

I was out in Steve's new studio looking at the hood this evening after GAS finished up and he does have a wall at the back of the hood that is 2x6 framing. He built out from that wall with metal studs leaving a dead air space and a bunch of non combustibles and screwed fire rated sheet rock to that. I plan to do the same in my new shop.

[Michael Stoddard]

After various people around our place have thrown their .02 into how this started there are 2 theories I'm subscribing to. They both have to deal with the melted electrical cord going from the wall to the kiln controller. The melted part went between the outlet and to just behind the kiln lid (which path it obviously shouldn't have been in). There was a kiln shelf board which just happened to be leaning behind the kiln which appears to have prevented the wire from burning more the other direction. The first theory is heat venting through the lid of the kiln melted the insulation on the wire and the wires started shorting together and burned back to the outlet. The second theory is that the outlet failed, possibly because the cord was pulled at an angle which would have twisted the prongs on the plug slightly which could have been another source of sparking. This kiln had been fired numerous times on that position and the wires have never melted before, but their could have been a small stone fall off the lid leaving a slightly larger heat vent (or something completely random like that), or the program could have been set to a longer hold. The pottery didn't come out overfired so the final temperature doesn't seem to have been hotter than usual. It was also impossible to determine if the breaker tripped because the fire department switched all the individual breakers off in the building. The wood table holding the beveling equipment which burned up was pretty close to the kiln outlet and someone seems to remember a piece of plywood leaning against it. There was also a chair with wood and fabric parts on it close to the whole mess. I have been unable to hear the official opinions of the insurance's "experts" that inspected it for us. I sure hope we learned enough to prevent another one. I reckon I'll know if we really learned our lesson when I die if I can look back and this was the only fire in the place. I hope it's the only fire in any place I work. Even reading the responses to this thread has taught me more things to keep an eye out for. Another benefit from CraftWeb membership: It may save your studio from burning down.

[Ed Schmid]

c'mon Michael...it sounds like you didn't want to come in to work on Monday...tired of making floppy bowls and Treavor rich?...

'jus' kidding.
In reality I am glad to hear you all didn't get any worse loss or damage than what you did.
fire is scary, as every bit as Pete mentions.
It is something we all take for granted, that we "play" with fire and usually get by with.[burns being about the worst of it].
I know that those small portable propane bottles (5 gal. units) + hand torches make every fire inspector VERY nervous...for a very good reason.
If you use such a unit, I suggest getting a long hose and keep the tank outside, or hard plumb a quick disconnect line you can plug and unplug as needed.

Review the other notes regarding fire safety in the rest of the archives
(if they are still there). There were some eye-opening posts that made me very aware of the use and placement of building materials and "protective walls-heat shields etc.).
play it safe, invest in your future to blow glass, and sleep well when you turn off the lights to your shop at night.
Ed

[Mike Aurelius]

I know that those small portable propane bottles (5 gal. units) + hand torches make every fire inspector VERY nervous...for a very good reason.
If you use such a unit, I suggest getting a long hose and keep the tank outside, or hard plumb a quick disconnect line you can plug and unplug as needed.



For good reason too!

NFP 58: This is the defining code for propane.

There are still people out there who think that it is OK to keep propane inside. So, without further ado, here are the salient portions of NFP 58:

6.2 Location of Containers

6.2.1 LP-Gas containers shall be located outside buldings unless they are specifically allowed to be inside of buildings.

6.2.2 LP-Gas containers shall be allowed in buildings only for the following applications:

(1) Cylinders as specifically provided for under Section 6.19 (see below).
(2) Containers of less than 125 gallons for the purpose of being filled.
(3) Containers on LP-Gas vehicles complying with and parked or garaged in accordance with Chapter 9.
(4) Containers used with LP-Gas stationary or portable engine fuel systems complying with Chapter 11.
(5) Containers used with LP-Gas fueled trucks complying with Chapter 11.
(6) Containers used on LP-Gas fueled vehicles garaged in accordance with Chapter 11.
(7) Cylinders awaiting use, resale or exchange when stored in accordance with Chapter 8.

***NOTE: These are the only allowed inside storage of LP cylinders under the code.

Other parts of the code that might interest you:

6.6.2 Installation of cylinders

6.6.2.1 Containers shall be installed only above ground and shall be set upon a firm foundation or otherwise be firmly secured. The cylinder shall not be in contact with the soil.

6.6.2.2 Flexibility shall be provided in the connecting piping. Where flexible connectors are used they shall comply with 6.9.6.

Section 6.19 covers allowable inside use and storage of propane cylinders. These are limited to a maximum liquid capacity of 100 pounds. Additionally, it states “limited to those conditions where operational requirements make the indoor use of cylinders necessary and outside location is impractical.”

6.19.4 Building undergoing construction or major renovation
6.19.5 Building undergoing major renovation where frequented by the public
6.19.6 Buildings housing industrial occupancies
6.19.7 Buildings housing institutional and educations occupancies

6.19.7.1 The use of cylinders in classrooms shall be prohibited unless they are used temporarily for classroom demonstrations in accordance with 6.19.9.1.
6.19.7.2 Where cylinders are used in buildings housing institutional and educational laboratory occupancies for research and experimental purposes. Cylinders must not be stored (in use or not) in the laboratory room.
6.19.8 Temporary heating and food service applications in buildings in emergencies
6.19.9 Use in buildings for demonstrations or training and use of small cylinders for self-contained torch assemblies and food service appliances.

6.19.9.1 Limit 5 lb propane capacity, for self-contained torch assemblies, the limit is 1 lp propane capacity.

6.19.10 Use in a building for flame effects before a proximate audience
6.19.11 Cylinders on roofs and balconies

***NOTE: many major restrictions i.e.: building shall be of fire-resistant construction or non-combustible construction AND essentially non-combustible contents or contents are protected with automatic sprinklers.

6.19.12 Liquid LP-Gas piped into buildings or structures

***NOTE: the above (6.19.4 - 6.19.12) are the ONLY indoor usages allowed under the code.

[Franklin Sankar]

Michael, did you have a smoke or fire detector in the studio? I ask because I tried to put one on my ceiling but it would false trigger often for very good reasons I guess.
If you dont mind my reference to where you were before the fire, but that sounds like a hell of an experience.:D . Looks like the firemen was on it in a flash, our firemen usually responds promptly most of the time but sometimes their water runs out. Glad the studio was saved.
Franklin

[Michael Stoddard]

Ed: Thanks for the reply and the good information. If this was all a ploy on my part to get work off Monday I would be in a seriously desperate situation. I now would only have 3 more quarters of the building to burn down for future vacations :). I never get sick of making the floppy bowls
(especially these days with how well the new larger ones are selling). Good to hear from ya. Every once in a while I mention trying to hire you to come to our studio for some private instruction. Hopefully if EVER the right people agree to it you still do that sort of thing at the time.

Franklin: We did have a smoke and fire alarm system recently upgraded, which is what we can credit for the early detection. The alarm company calls security from the property where we lease, which is supposed to be on hand 24/7, but for some reason there was only one guard on duty who had to run an errand of sorts. They then called the owner and the fire department, who showed up at about the same time. Because the only security guard on duty was gone, I'm guessing if the alarm company didn't call the fire department we would have lost a bit more of the building and tons of stained glass windows before someone at the nearby movie theater saw it. The smoke damage would have undoubtedly gotten into the gallery and messed up a bunch of paintings too.

We got most of the mess cleaned up now. We're having an electrician disconnect the damaged wiring and running a new line to the sandblaster's new location. He should get that and the 20 hp compressor back up this week and then the stained glass operation should be back at near full capacity, minus beveling, and squeezed on space.

[Brian Blanthorn]

he does have a wall at the back of the hood that is 2x6 framing. He built out from that wall with metal studs leaving a dead air space and a bunch of non combustibles and screwed fire rated sheet rock to that. I plan to do the same in my new shop.


I thought dead air space was bad as they could heat up become very hot over the years n eventually self combust this was from a similar thread a while back


While ur all doing this very sensable paranoia

Dont forget flooding either from busts within or from flooding outside

Here we have holes in wall 2 let water out n everyhing is lifted up off floor wet stuff is checked 4 drips on electrics etc

Here the risk of external flooding is very low as we on hill

Colin Reid had a bad flood last year from outside water

Seems flooding risk is on the increase n spreading in2 " safe " areas

Brian