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Cecil McKenzie
12-28-2011, 07:42 PM
I have a customer that would like to have me marver up some small diamonds ,emeralds and rubies. I suggested this might not be a good use for these items but he says he doesn't have much in them so not to worry if they are ruined. He thinks since they are hard they won't be affected. Has anyone tried something like this?

Pete VanderLaan
12-28-2011, 08:05 PM
He is just ever so wrong... get paid up front.

Henry Halem
12-28-2011, 09:23 PM
Hard has nothing to do with it. Does he know that diamond is actually coal?

David Hopman
12-28-2011, 09:57 PM
We had this exact thing happen and we tried it. The glass shattered around the gems. Surprisingly we got the gems out of the glass without damaging them.

Pete VanderLaan
12-29-2011, 04:32 AM
We had this exact thing happen and we tried it. The glass shattered around the gems. Surprisingly we got the gems out of the glass without damaging them.
***********
Well, there you go. Think of hot glass as the exciting wrapping paper for your intended's big gift.

Tom Fuhrman
12-29-2011, 09:45 AM
what you might try is to create a bubble and insert the jewels into the bubble loose and then close the bubble so the jewels are encased in a glass envelope and can move independently of the glass. We used to do this with coins and all types of other items. There used to be a lot of old traditional paperweights made that had ceramic dice that were encapsulated this way and then you could still shake the dice. also souvenir mini bottles with copper pennies in them or other copper items. If the items are loose and are allowed to expand there may not be any problems. Just an idea.
To do this you have to blow the piece, then punty it up and carefully insert the items. then carefully heat just the opening to allow you to close it up. If you want it thick, you'll have to get another gather or 2 and carefully drop those over the original bubble gather without getting the insides screaming hot. Takes a good amount of heat control and timing to get it right and may take a few tries.

Sandy Dukeshire
12-29-2011, 11:28 AM
if someone is going to supply the goods, dont let anyone talk you out of trying it.

preheat the stones and pick them up off something hot, not on a cold marver. I had success with garnets. only one cracked because I exposed it to the direct flame in the gloryhole. also, at the torch i blew small bubbles on a straw sized 'pipe' and dropped small stones down the straw and into the bubble, then jacked the line tight to make mini lightbulb-filled-with-stones type earrings and stuff. this is what Tom is talking aboutish.

Rich Federici
12-29-2011, 11:39 PM
I have a friend who has been plagued with kidney stones, and wanted to see if we could put some in a paperweight. After gathering enough glass to make the weight, I poked a hole with an icepick and used a steam stick to blow the interior bubble. Open a little with jacks and drop in the kidney stones. They kind of pulverized inside the opening, and you can see the stone dust rolling around in there. They are definitely sealed in for posterity!

We thought about casing them directly. I am told that they are basically calcium, but I was not sure if that much of a concentration of calcium would agree with the glass. So we opted for the steam bubble method.

Ben David
12-30-2011, 02:22 AM
We had this exact thing happen and we tried it. The glass shattered around the gems. Surprisingly we got the gems out of the glass without damaging them.
- - - - - - - - - - - - -
You were lucky.

Most gemstones - and other crystals - have cleavage planes (which is how they split rough diamonds with a tap of a chisel).

A small impurity + heat stress = split or shattered crystal.

I would definitely get this person to sign a waiver before doing this work.

Ben David

Pete VanderLaan
12-30-2011, 04:59 AM
I have a friend who has been plagued with kidney stones, and wanted to see if we could put some in a paperweight. After gathering enough glass to make the weight, I poked a hole with an icepick and used a steam stick to blow the interior bubble. Open a little with jacks and drop in the kidney stones. They kind of pulverized inside the opening, and you can see the stone dust rolling around in there. They are definitely sealed in for posterity!

We thought about casing them directly. I am told that they are basically calcium, but I was not sure if that much of a concentration of calcium would agree with the glass. So we opted for the steam bubble method.
******
Gross.

Warren Trefz
12-30-2011, 03:31 PM
There is a company encasing diamonds in boro goblet stems. I think it is called Diamonds in Glass. As others have suggested, the bubble method works best. I use to make goblets with loose gemstones in the stems. I would have all the parts made with the cup in the garage, one assistant brought the gems and poured them in, a quick flash, assistant brings hot bit while another brings the cup, stick it together, quick flash, and box it. If you get the glass too hot the gems stick and will crack the soda-lime glass. Also check the melting temperature of the stones as most will not take the heat. Others will change color or dull as most colored stones are enhanced by heat or dyed or sliced and glued to a cheaper base. Hope that helps.

Warren

Rahman Anderson
12-30-2011, 05:48 PM
off topic but anyone know the heat treatment for garnets, rubies, emeralds. almost all you see are cloudy and dark till fired. I was just shown a neat little collection a friend mined with her family but have only heard tales...I know...google it.

Eben Horton
12-30-2011, 10:18 PM
Lampworkers put synthetic garnets in glass all the time

Allison Fonda
01-02-2012, 06:22 PM
I was a jeweler for a few years before I got into glass. There are a few stones that you can set in wax, burn it out and put it in a centrifuge to cast with metals. some stones can withstand the temperatures very easily. Diamonds are certainly one of them. Although I trust the person who said it wasn't compatible with the glass.
In the past I have used cubic zirconias. I would just heat up a small section of a bubble and press it in. No check, no looseness, nothing. works very well.

I would look up what temperatures that rubies can withstand.
And as far as the diamonds, if you encase them in glass, they should withstand the temperature. And if the glass chips, just break it open and pull out the stone.
But you are lucky that the guy doesn't care what happens. Sounds like a fun project.

Sandy Dukeshire
01-23-2012, 08:57 PM
ok Cecil. what gives? we need to know how this project turned out.

Cecil McKenzie
01-24-2012, 02:11 PM
It is on going. The subject came up when we were making a wedding gift which has been done. While the couple were at the studio I made a small bottle form and used my copa to pour some loose gems inside the bottle then sealed it with an avolio type form. It annealed just fine , the gems seem intact , and we are probably going to make some goblets with a ball in the stem with gems inside the ball. This will be in a while. I just turned off a week ago to get a break from paying the propane bill. The price of propane is tied to the price of oil which they say is going to stay up so looking a $4 gallon gas this summer. The art fair business doesn't look too good going forward. Fortunately I have discovered the power of negative thinking.

While messing with this gem thing I did think of trying a wheat penny in a hollow ball and make a marble from it. I have about a half a gallon of wheat pennies that I could turn into "wheat state" keepsake, local color marbles for the tourist trade. Has any one put a penny in their glass? I have seen early American pieces with dimes but don't recall seeing any pennies. There's my two cents.

Kenny Pieper
01-24-2012, 03:49 PM
Yes I have seen pennies. They do have to be the old copper ones.

Tom Fuhrman
01-24-2012, 04:01 PM
I used to do the penny in the small bottle many years ago as a crowd pleasing demo piece. Kenny right though, use copper pennies.