PDA

View Full Version : Tetra Isopropyl Titanate


Sky Campbell
03-08-2012, 12:33 PM
Has anyone seen this in a solid? I just opened a new drum today to find it is pretty much all solidified with a small amount of liquid on top.
Obviously this has precipitated out of solution somehow but as of now I really don't know what could have caused that. Possibly moisture but this is a sealed drum from W.R. Grace. Does anyone know if this can freeze and stay solid?

I just rebuilt my fuming chamber new foot operated sprayer moved from plastic to metal (stanus originally) new exhaust fan ready to go. Melted a very heavy silver bearing glass and now no fancy fume to try.

I have a call into W.R. Grace but while I'm waiting on a reply I thought I would ask here.

Foster Holcombe
03-08-2012, 12:42 PM
The tetra isopropyl titanate starts to solidify at about 50 degrees. We leave our drum next to the furnace during the winter and that seems to work. Hope this helps.:)

Pete VanderLaan
03-08-2012, 01:10 PM
So get yourself a manly fuming agent that actually looks good - Stannous chloride!

Sky Campbell
03-08-2012, 01:19 PM
I'm here in sunny Florida 81 here today. Will this freeze and stay solidified? I really doubt that's the case but really I don't have a clue. Still waiting to here back.

Haha yes I agree Stannous chloride and variations of make for some of the best fumes. Besides being ridiculously corrosive it's has maintance issues I just don't want to deal with. I really haven't given this isopropyl titanate a good try and who knows maybe I will find something new and exciting. I have to find out for myself.

John Van Koningsveld
03-08-2012, 05:07 PM
You will be underwhelmed.

Pete VanderLaan
03-08-2012, 05:16 PM
Listless, anemic, icky.

Sky Campbell
03-08-2012, 09:24 PM
Come on guys even over a silver doped glass. I really hope your wrong but alass I haven't ever really seen a good TIPT fume.

YET!

Still waiting to hear back from W.R.Grace. I think they will just replace it but I would love to know why it solidified.

Eben Horton
03-08-2012, 09:50 PM
it looks like something made in china when you spray that shit on it..

Mark Rosenbaum
03-09-2012, 12:06 AM
it looks like something made in china when you spray that shit on it..

I guess my shit looks Chinese

Virgil Jones
03-09-2012, 07:49 AM
I remember when dichroic was poopooed

Virgil Jones
03-09-2012, 07:58 AM
I remember when dichroic was poopooed

Before that I remember "make it big and make it blue".

Pete VanderLaan
03-09-2012, 08:37 AM
Well, this comes full circle. Before that it was fuming glass to cover up the cords and stones! We used Stannous chloride interestingly enough.

Pete VanderLaan
03-09-2012, 08:37 AM
I remember when dichroic was poopooed
********
It still is.

Virgil Jones
03-09-2012, 09:12 AM
Well, this comes full circle. Before that it was fuming glass to cover up the cords and stones! We used Stannous chloride interestingly enough.

That's because tipt was to delicate and artsy!!

That's a theory that I've had for a long time...a lot of standard glass decoration techniques were originally covers for mistakes, oopsesss, or just plain "I can't sell it that way and I ain't throwing it out!!!!"

James Ennis
03-09-2012, 10:37 AM
titp must be kept at 70m deg. or it freezes, read your msds. it will be fine when
you get it warmer...hope you know how to dilute it.

Eben Horton
03-09-2012, 11:09 AM
I guess my shit looks Chinese

who are we to say? the person buying your glass will make the ultimate judgement. :)

Virgil Jones
03-09-2012, 11:36 AM
Graingers and other places sell drum "belt" heaters. Or just blast a couple of little heaters on it. I've never had a problem with it once it's thawed out.

Sky Campbell
03-09-2012, 02:17 PM
titp must be kept at 70m deg. or it freezes, read your msds. it will be fine when
you get it warmer...hope you know how to dilute it.

No freezing. Sunny fl mid 80's during the day 70's at night. Yes I've read the msd and I know it freezes at 50f. It has not been that could in a while.

I do not know how to dilute it and did not think I should be diluting it. I would guess it dilutes in isapropyal alchol but I wouldn't know why I would dilute it. Please tell explain did I miss something should I be diluting this fume?

Thankyou all for the enlightenment. I see some of you have used this fume with very nice results. I hope I can find the same.

Still waiting to hear back from W.R.Grace and will update when I do.

Pete VanderLaan
03-09-2012, 02:48 PM
I guess my shit looks Chinese
**********
I'm sure Eben meant Taiwan.

Virgil Jones
03-09-2012, 03:04 PM
No freezing. Sunny fl mid 80's during the day 70's at night. Yes I've read the msd and I know it freezes at 50f. It has not been that could in a while.

I do not know how to dilute it and did not think I should be diluting it. I would guess it dilutes in isapropyal alchol but I wouldn't know why I would dilute it. Please tell explain did I miss something should I be diluting this fume?

Thankyou all for the enlightenment. I see some of you have used this fume with very nice results. I hope I can find the same.

Still waiting to hear back from W.R.Grace and will update when I do.

Exposure to the air affects it negatively. Contact with water affects it negatively. There is a different look to it "freezing"...looks like a crystalline network. When it's ruined it just looks like a white chalky substance.
I would push W.R. Grace for a prompter response.

Ron Mynatt
03-09-2012, 10:45 PM
I would not dilute it .I have tried with isopropyl alcohol it was not a good thing.I am guessing since I just got my 5 gal and it had also frozen that where ever they shipped it from was cold a few days ago. The boxes they ship in are well insulated to protect from damage. Sky I think yours has just not got up to the right temp. I put mine next to my furnace and it is starting to thaw.

Robert Gary Parkes
03-12-2012, 08:42 PM
vile.. evil.. muck...

Pete VanderLaan
03-13-2012, 05:24 AM
vile.. evil.. muck...
**********
Now that's the kind of qualitative analysis I expect from around here!

Sky Campbell
03-13-2012, 09:27 AM
Thank you everyone for your help. No definitive answer why but we have determined it was a problem from the factory. Possibly isolated incident possibly bad batch run. Either way back to work. I'll post a couple pictures after I get to play.

One puzzling problem msds says freezing point is 50 and then was told it can freeze at higher temps closer to 60. Either way it's been nothing but warm here. I just wonder how could it not have a determined freezing temp and why would it vary? I would think that TIPT would always be exactly the same. Exspecially if it's considered reagent grade. Go figure.

Tom Clifton
03-13-2012, 10:07 AM
have determined it was a problem from the factory. Possibly isolated incident possibly bad batch run.

Many years ago my Dad ran the outfit that installed Astroturf for Monsanto (SportInstall). Business was booming - all Colleges 'had' to have the stuff. In the early 70's they started getting repair orders for fields installed in 1969. None of the early ones from the mid 60's to 68, nor any from the 70's. All the failures were the same - big loose pockets of grass in the middle of the panels. Problem was traced to a glue failure. Seems the factory that made the contact cement was surrounded by flood water in the spring of 1968, and the extra humidity in the air caused a couple of fautly batches. Bad things happen to folks that make nice chemicals...

Pete VanderLaan
03-13-2012, 11:02 AM
Thank you everyone for your help. No definitive answer why but we have determined it was a problem from the factory. Possibly isolated incident possibly bad batch run. Either way back to work. I'll post a couple pictures after I get to play.

One puzzling problem msds says freezing point is 50 and then was told it can freeze at higher temps closer to 60. Either way it's been nothing but warm here. I just wonder how could it not have a determined freezing temp and why would it vary? I would think that TIPT would always be exactly the same. Exspecially if it's considered reagent grade. Go figure.
*******
Well there's also the old axiom "Shit Happens". One crystals start to grow, it's their life mission. It's why devitrification is serious stuff in a glass furnace. Your furnace has cancer essentially.