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Chris Lowry
05-30-2012, 06:45 PM
Why is it so hard to make a good pair of Jacks?

My old Dino's are like butter... the best jacks I've ever had but they are getting worn out and are looking like washboards.

I've tried tons of new ones, jim moore, carlo dona, cutting edge but they all stick like crazy, rub off metal, leave marks...

My older cutting edge were nice as well but the newer ones stick. I thought they needed to break in but after two months of use they still stick and leave metal like crazy.

Am I asking too much to get a nice pair of Jacks that work like the old Dino's?

Travis Frink
05-30-2012, 06:56 PM
The marukos are based on Dinos. Don't remember which model but I think it says on his website. Not sure about the steel. A friend here just got a new pair of goblet jacks that look nice. If you decide to get a pair, I would pick up a pair of tweezers too, as they are great for a lot of things- especially pulling lips and matching up the ends of Rollups that don't have a straight, even seam.

David Patchen
05-30-2012, 07:34 PM
I've tried tons of new ones, jim moore, carlo dona, cutting edge but they all stick like crazy, rub off metal, leave marks...

My older cutting edge were nice as well but the newer ones stick. I thought they needed to break in but after two months of use they still stick and leave metal like crazy.

I think you'll get better results if you work hotter and stop tooling as the glass firms up. Scratches are due to imperfections or gouges on your jacks or dirt on your jacks or wax. Clean them well w/a scotchbrite then get them hot and wax them w/clean waxy and they should be fine. Leave the black stuff on unless it's not smooth.

Eben Horton
05-30-2012, 10:55 PM
Its all in the steel...

David Hopman
05-30-2012, 11:59 PM
Its all in the steel...

Maruko. Japanese steel.

Mike Hanson
05-31-2012, 01:16 AM
IIRC someone talked about making the blades with some good old AMERICAN MADE steel from leaf springs off of a late 50's american made truck...and, hotter is always better.

Greg Vriethoff
05-31-2012, 03:51 AM
It's not the tool(s).

I was raised on Jim Moore's. I think his cup jacks are some of the best out there.

No metal deposits on glass (not visible, but even if you can't see it, it's still there).

You said yourself "they are getting worn out and are looking like washboards."

Where do you think the metal went?

Steel tools wear when they are abraded by cold glass plain and simple.

As some have already said here "work hotter."

Hot is good.

One of my teachers/mentors had the opportunity to ask Dino where his "special" steel came from.

In a heavy Italian accent he replied "Pittsburgh."

Eben Horton
05-31-2012, 06:09 AM
If you get your blades really waxy and lay them on the side of a mass of glass the size of 3 gathers when it's freshly gathered and just keep riding the blades, you can "season" them just like a cast iron frying Pan. The wax will go black and leave a "non-stick" coating on the steel. Never scrub that black coating off...

The best jacks ever made were made by Ivan Smith. He also made the best diamond shears. I have Dino's, but I always go for my Ivan's.

Michael Mortara
05-31-2012, 07:07 PM
Maruko from Artco, close as you can get to Dino. Leave on the black till it gets super crusty.
Still using the Dino's I got in '92......
Jim Moore did a super job rehabbing another pair I have, might be worth a try.
Chris is a big boy, I think he knows about the "work hotter" thing.

David Russell
05-31-2012, 07:15 PM
As if you need another maraku endorsement, but i did get a pair last year and they were far and away better than anything i had ever used.

i will say even better than dinos because they are affordable and readily available!

Someone here said a while back "they don't make a bad jack line ever" ........and i think i agree!!!!

David Patchen
05-31-2012, 11:20 PM
Third that. I have two pair of Maruko jacks and love them. The oval blades rock for big stuff.

Rollin Karg
06-01-2012, 05:47 AM
Picking jacks for me is like finding the right woman, not so much logic, just something about the way they feel. For me, my favorites are a pair of large Carlo Dona's. I've had them for awhile and they seem to fit my hand just right.
Ordinarily when I move around my shop, I use whatever jacks happen to be on that bench. When I pickup the Dona's there is just the right feel to them. I do have a number of jacks, probably at least one pair from anyone that ever made a pair. That includes a few all stainless ones made by me.

I still keep looking at them and I'm sure I haven't bought or made my last pair.

Pete VanderLaan
06-01-2012, 06:08 AM
I still keep looking at them and I'm sure I haven't bought or made my last pair.
**********************
Patti will be relieved.

Rollin Karg
06-01-2012, 12:06 PM
**********************
Patti will be relieved.

Lol, I knew we were going get off topic here !!!

Chris Lowry
06-01-2012, 06:54 PM
Thanks for the suggestions, I'll try Maruka.

I don't think there is a special steal but there is the "Right" steal. When someone asks me "How did you do that" I say "frit" so I'm not surprised Dino would not have more to say about that. It's not like you want to keep secrets but you don't go right out and teach someone how to do something that took you years to learn. Of course all jacks wear out and leave some steal but some are better than others. We are a little hard on jacks so I wouldn't complain about them wearing out but they should work well threw their life.

Robert Gary Parkes
06-01-2012, 10:13 PM
the best steel made was in the 30's, in Germany,
after WW2 there was lots of it left around in Italy, mostly in wrecked tanks.
that's where Dino got it...

David Patchen
06-01-2012, 10:27 PM
Thanks for the suggestions, I'll try Maruka.

I don't think there is a special steal but there is the "Right" steal. When someone asks me "How did you do that" I say "frit" so I'm not surprised Dino would not have more to say about that. It's not like you want to keep secrets but you don't go right out and teach someone how to do something that took you years to learn. Of course all jacks wear out and leave some steal but some are better than others. We are a little hard on jacks so I wouldn't complain about them wearing out but they should work well threw their life.

But you know you really should pay for them.

Greg Vriethoff
06-03-2012, 03:34 PM
I'm curious now about the Marukos.

What's the spring like in the strap (firm or loose)?

My main complaint with Cutting Edge is the relative looseness of the strap compared to Jim Moore. I like(d) the blade profile though.

It's somewhat the same for me with the Donas. Just feels a little bit sloppy.

I like the CD small diamond shears. Those rock for goblet work. Same goes for the Dante diamonds from CE.

Eben Horton
06-03-2012, 05:25 PM
the best steel made was in the 30's, in Germany,
after WW2 there was lots of it left around in Italy, mostly in wrecked tanks.
that's where Dino got it...

Really?? What is your source for this info