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-   -   new furnace toys.... (http://talk.craftweb.com/showthread.php?t=12010)

Eben Horton 06-26-2018 10:07 AM

new furnace toys....
 
just received one of these and a variable speed blower from Charlie Correll.... all for just about $1K. with the electric savings from decommissioning my huge eclipse blower this should all pay for itself in about a year I think.. 2 at the very most. The Vanessa controller can do everything that a partlow MIC 6000 can do at a third the price. This set up also costs about the same as a new Honeywell damper motor, which I just fried... so that is the reason why I made the switch.

http://www.digitry.com/vanessa/

Pete VanderLaan 06-26-2018 10:46 AM

I have a variable speed Charlie sold me out of Germany that ties to the servo. That puppy is loud. 12 in WC but did I mention it's loud?

Josh Bernbaum 06-26-2018 12:25 PM

Yeah mine from Grainger is a bit noisy too but I have it in an insulated separate room. The one I have doesn't draw very much power, 400w max I think. You won't be disappointed getting rid of that motor-arm air valve. My max output set on the controller is only 42% of the fan's top speed, plenty of BTUs for this color furnace that I can fit up to a 16" pot in so I think this little blower could handle a much larger furnace as well.

Patrick Casanova 06-26-2018 01:27 PM

When I moved my studio back to my barn from Main St. I no longer had 3Phase power. The Owner of an local electric motor repair business that deals mostly with manufacturing and industrial users, hooked me up with an LG Adjustable Frequency Drive. I love it. It controls my big eclipse pressure blower. When my furnace is at idle the burner only needs 3 Water Column inches of pressure, which equals 27% power to the motor. When I light the GH I need 9 WC" and I'm still only need 50% power to my motor. It is capable of 12" when I need it. It has cut my electric bill in half.

I had to mount a relay between my panel box and the LG. I don't run a re-ignition system. The Fire Eye is more sensitive to electrical flickers than the LG. The LG has a longer, half a second wait time. So if my lights flicker the Fireye shuts the gas valve and blower kept blowing. Even at the lowest setting. So now the relay trips with the same sensitivity as the Flame safety.

It has been 7 years, but at the time it was cheaper to do the LG controller than it was to switch out my 3 Phase to a single phase motor, and the variability came along as an added bonus.

Eben Horton 06-26-2018 05:42 PM

Wow. That is cool ! Thatís th first I have ever heard of making a big 20 amp blower variable speed. I gave my new blower a test run on the b much and it wasnít that loud.

Franklin Sankar 06-26-2018 07:53 PM

You all talking about gas furnaces?
Franklin

Eben Horton 06-26-2018 09:39 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Franklin Sankar (Post 140378)
You all talking about gas furnaces?
Franklin

Yes Franklin.

Jon Myers 06-26-2018 10:57 PM

You should check out the variable speed blower Busch makes... Tiny, quiet, powerful and cheap. (also variable speed)

Scott Benefield 06-27-2018 12:54 AM

Jon:
Do you have a link? All I could find was this: https://www.buschvacuum.com/uk/en/products/tyr

James Burts 06-27-2018 08:34 AM

I don't know anything about this company, or their products--- but am in the market for a blower, so a blower that's described as tiny, quiet, powerful and cheap certainly catches my attention. I'll believe it when I see it, but I was willing to browse their website and look over specs.

My guess is that the product Jon was talking about is not the Tyr, but instead the Samos. https://www.buschvacuum.com/us/en/products/samos

I'm seeing options that certainly are tiny and quiet--- one model where the spec sheet states it's 15 pounds, smaller than a 10" cube, and 53 Db--- but looks to be rated for 35 CFM. Tiny blower
They also have models rated into the thousands of CFM, but obviously aren't so tiny or quiet.

My question is what is a good target of CFM? I've always overbought for blowers and then dialed back the amount of air with a gate valve. How much air do I really need in order to operate a glory hole or two?

--James--
James Burts

Quote:

Originally Posted by Scott Benefield (Post 140383)
Jon:
Do you have a link? All I could find was this: https://www.buschvacuum.com/uk/en/products/tyr


Patrick Casanova 06-27-2018 08:56 AM

Eben,

Mine is not a variable speed motor. The inverter does it all. From past operations I knew that at 3 WC" my burner would keep my furnace at 2100F, so we used a minimum of 3WC" pressure as the important determinant and dialed back the speed until we maintained that level of pressure for an idle setting. We did the same with the upper limit needed for the GH. So when we go to light the GH I push the program button, the up arrow to the number needed and hit enter. Now the RPM are sufficient to produce the 9 WC" of pressure to the air manifold. I don't have to do anything to the furnace settings the butterfly valve on the furnace air keeps the pressure at 3". The drive can take a signal from a controller to operate the system for general furnace operation. Here's a link I have the iS3.

https://www.scribd.com/presentation/193220676/LG-VFD

Jon Myers 06-30-2018 09:55 PM

I'm in Mexico right now getting some medical treatment but when I get back to the shop I'll get the model number and what have you. You have to have an account but it's easy to set up, and if you don't have the part # it takes forever to get it. Even if you and the account rep both know the blower you are talking about. But great blowers... We ordered an extra 8-10 years ago and it's only now starting to sound like it's time to switch out. And
The blower might only need the plug connection reworked. They are sturdy. And a 18"gloryhole needs it turned almost all the way down.

Eben Horton 07-17-2018 03:23 PM

I figured I should post an update on this. I am very happy with this blower and controller.
If I compare savings to Ed Branson who made this conversion as well, I should pay for the controller and blower in about 12 months.

It is mounted in a small electrical box behold the furnace and is just about silent at idle and working temp. High fire it gets kind of loud, but its hardly an issue as when its on high fire I am just doing the charge.

To be able to flip the switch at the end of the day and turn off the big blower is so nice... the shop is silent.

To do the conversion took me about 2 hours. not hard at all.

if anyone wants to do this conversion, talk to Charlie Correll.. he was super helpful on the phone......

Eben Horton 07-22-2018 09:33 AM

Sooo quiet...

Iím quite smitten.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=O-v9W9AnVWY

Brian Graham 07-22-2018 09:53 AM

Almost zero noise.

Josh Bernbaum 07-22-2018 10:25 AM

What make/model is that blower Eben?

Eben Horton 07-22-2018 04:37 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Josh Bernbaum (Post 140707)
What make/model is that blower Eben?

Charlie correll only referred the name of the blower as 'Trinity' and its made in Germany. It does not operate on 4-20 milliamp so I also purchased a Vanessa controller from him as well... Truth be told i was extremely nervous about all of these changes, but I couldn't be happier.. I can't recommend it enough.

The blower does obviously get louder when its at high fire, but its no louder than my old 20 amp eclipse blower..

Eben Horton 07-22-2018 04:41 PM

I remember now.. its a EBM Pabst Trinity blower made in Germany.

Rick Kellner 07-24-2018 03:14 PM

Eben,

This sounds pretty slick. Short of calling Charlie, can you offer any insight on interfacing the Vanessa controller and the Trinity blower? Barring the 4 to 20 mA loop, which output mode does it utilize? It looks like you need to select the special furnace version of the controller too, for the higher temperature range thermocouples.

Eben Horton 07-24-2018 09:00 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Rick Kellner (Post 140743)
Eben,

This sounds pretty slick. Short of calling Charlie, can you offer any insight on interfacing the Vanessa controller and the Trinity blower? Barring the 4 to 20 mA loop, which output mode does it utilize? It looks like you need to select the special furnace version of the controller too, for the higher temperature range thermocouples.

I believe the Vanessa uses Pulse Width modulation. This is what a lot of motor controllers use to communicate.

I canít recommend this set up enough.


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