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  #26  
Old 06-23-2017, 02:25 PM
Hugh Jenkins Hugh Jenkins is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Pete VanderLaan View Post
I like that. So, which are you exactly?
It is always better to be ignorant than stupid. Ignorance is curable.
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  #27  
Old 06-23-2017, 02:56 PM
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Pete VanderLaan Pete VanderLaan is offline
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we allow ourselves some levity when in these lines of trade Hugh.
I'm pretty sure Art knows I'm just poking fun at his observations.

Today I am having to pre explain that the pots we are sending out right now which are a lovely shade of Orange inside is caused by Lithium Citrate and will burn off on firing. We considered not sending them but there's no serious reason to reject them. I also explained today to a client that pots wear if you just leave them in a furnace running for two years with glass in them. It's that old adage about glass being the universal solvent.
.
Somewhere along the line, someone decided that pots should last for years and years. The entire point of pots vs tanks back around 1975 was to put a fresh refractory liner in your furnace once a year. Some clients are careful, Some clients aren't so careful. I still stick to the notion of the day a pot goes in service that you should be putting a "replace pot " date on the calendar.
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  #28  
Old 06-24-2017, 12:24 AM
Dennis Hetland Dennis Hetland is offline
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Originally Posted by Josh Bernbaum View Post
Maybe all that's needed is just a disclaimer on your website and on a piece of paper with what gets sent out warning not to heat up the crucible too quickly, not to leave it at 2380F, and not to whack it with a hammer.
Not to rest the pipe on the edge of the pot when gathering.
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  #29  
Old 06-24-2017, 02:42 PM
Art Freas Art Freas is offline
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Originally Posted by Pete VanderLaan View Post
I like that. So, which are you exactly?
I do try to learn, but still can't weld. It's a time thing right now.
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  #30  
Old 06-24-2017, 03:00 PM
Hugh Jenkins Hugh Jenkins is offline
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Originally Posted by Pete VanderLaan View Post
we allow ourselves some levity when in these lines of trade Hugh.
I'm pretty sure Art knows I'm just poking fun at his observations.
I get that Pete. I hoped I was adding support. I think I just got the connection between glassblowing and being a "crackpot".

Being "not too stupid" was a point of merit by DT this week. That shows ignorance that might not be curable.

Is there a discount for the orange pots? I don't even know why I am considering a backup at this point.
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  #31  
Old 06-24-2017, 03:51 PM
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No discount. Instead they have me 'splain stuff. The lithium citrate is something Les added to the mix to assist in making the stuff more thixotropic as a suspension as I understood him. In reducing atmospheres, which sometimes need to occur at the end of a kiln firing ( big kiln lots of other things in there) the material pinks the joint up. I see it occasionally on the outsides of pots when there has been direct flame impingement as well. It clears right off when the pot is refired.

I am leaving it to Jeff and Josh to finalize how they want to issue instructions. The stuff with the kiln maker an be dicey since the company also wants that business.I keep coming as a thorn in the side of commerce if I don't like the sales pitch. I kind of like that "Don't overheat it or hit it with a hammer. " It's sufficiently vague. Hugh you and I are of the generation of Ipsen pots and they turned into honey comb after eight months. I well remember Michael Nourot pitching them in that old Al Lewis Rag on glass. I think an 18 inch pot cost $22.00 I think you were down at Penland around then. Indeed get a spare. It won't hurt and it will keep you in the game. I have a lot of folks in our age group saying this is my last pot. I rarely blow anymore.
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  #32  
Old 06-24-2017, 03:53 PM
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Originally Posted by Art Freas View Post
I do try to learn, but still can't weld. It's a time thing right now.
***********
Art, If I can learn, anyone can learn. You need around two hours.
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  #33  
Old 06-24-2017, 04:48 PM
Hugh Jenkins Hugh Jenkins is offline
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Pete, Nourot didn't just have a spare pot around. He had a spare furnace, all rebuilt and ready to roll in when needed. The pot failure factor had to be considered all of the time.

I have had a crucible go for 125 melts. That is 2 1/2 years. The last one though, was only 70 melts. That is not a very specific safety range, and it "makes a man watchful".
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  #34  
Old 06-24-2017, 05:46 PM
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70 has always been the number at which I began to consider changing the pot out. 90 Was the max.
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  #35  
Old 06-25-2017, 09:29 AM
Tom Fuhrman Tom Fuhrman is offline
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as I remember Mark Peiser used to switch a pot out after 10 melts. I still remember seeing a stack of used pots in his yard about 5 feet high and 4 feet in diameter. Those were pots of about 12" diameter. I have never doubted his wisdom on almost anything.
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  #36  
Old 06-25-2017, 10:13 AM
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Pete VanderLaan Pete VanderLaan is offline
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Right now, Mark has dredged up an old pot from Harbison Walker from that very pile you refer to to do the enamel white melts we're messing with . Mark was always touchy about fresh pots, a 180 degree attitude difference from the investment crowd. I'm pretty much the same way about my color pots but that's more a contamination issue for me as opposed to cord free which is what Mark looks for.

The more interesting thing at Mark's was the belly dump of Cullet that Fritz got from Keystone those long years ago.

To the batcave!
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  #37  
Old 06-25-2017, 02:56 PM
Hugh Jenkins Hugh Jenkins is offline
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Originally Posted by Pete VanderLaan View Post
70 has always been the number at which I began to consider changing the pot out. 90 Was the max.
It does get hard to focus on the glass work when you are holding your breath.
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  #38  
Old 06-26-2017, 03:01 PM
Mitcheal Veenstra Mitcheal Veenstra is offline
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pots, like elements in an electric furnace, are consumables... plane pure and simple. To ever think otherwise is just silly...

I hear you Pete on the head shaking on what some of the kiln manufacturers are saying to people. And arguing with certain segments of the glassmaking population on factual things like pot and element life at certain temperatures and ramp schedules shortly leads to wanting to bang your head against a wall because there you'll get more satisfaction than the conversation you're having.

Thank you for posting the schedule information on the forum. Thank you even more for all the times in the past you've been there in email and other private messages when I had a question about pots or some other point of glassmaking.

And thank you again for my most recent pot, it's going back in for a slow empty ramp up after summer maintenance on my electric furnace, time to replace the elements and have a fresh new pot to melt my clear in!
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  #39  
Old 06-29-2017, 06:21 AM
charlie jenkins charlie jenkins is offline
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You know, I can't explain why i have been as successful as I have, but to say that I apprenticed and assisted and TA'd and took seminars and classes with many many other artists and up-coming glass makers......
People like me learn the mistakes of the people that have gone before us, and then we still make many many mistakes along our ways.
As for whiny mcwhiny face, they will need to learn to live with their mistakes and live to learn from their mistakes.
Success is measured by how one overcomes their failiers failirs faile'rs faults......
Anyway, I made the same mistake once of filling my crucible with sys nugs before firing and immediately discovered it cracked days later. Lesson: bring it up empty.
Anything else guy has questions about?
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  #40  
Old 06-29-2017, 07:10 AM
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Pete VanderLaan Pete VanderLaan is offline
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I appreciated the feedback. Mary Beth will now hand out the care and feeding instructions with invoices in the future. Interestingly, she asked the individual in question if he wanted our standard recommendations at the time the pot was purchased and got no response.
Most of our difficulty with this comes through the wire kiln manufacturers who really compete fiercely to sell converted ceramic kiln as glass furnaces. It's a low ball way to get in the field easily but having some education is kind of helpful. I don't see that happening.
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