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Old 12-06-2019, 10:01 AM
Shawn Everette Shawn Everette is offline
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Solder glass

Anyone have any experience with, or know where to get, solder glass powder or paste? I know Schott makes some, but I can't find an actual distributor. There's a couple chinese and japanese companies too, but same problem.
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Old 12-06-2019, 10:26 AM
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You'll have to describe that better. I was involved in a book on Pate de Verre last night and the question of what the glue really is seems to be an issue.
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Old 12-06-2019, 11:46 AM
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Hi Shawn,

A friend of mind did some experimentation back in grad school with single electrode neon (plasma) with cast glass. He had some success with solder, but he eventually abandoned the practice due to numerous failures in gallery settings. He told me he was made aware of the solder process by Ed Kirshner.

I would try reaching out to Ed first as he has more experience, and is still actively involved with plasma. If you can't get anywhere with that, contact my friend (tell Jason I sent you).

Ed Kirshner's contact page.

Jason Chakravarty's contact page.
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Old 12-06-2019, 11:49 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Pete VanderLaan View Post
You'll have to describe that better. I was involved in a book on Pate de Verre last night and the question of what the glue really is seems to be an issue.
My limited understanding of the material is that it is a high lead enamel that fuses at low temps. I don't know what temp..
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Last edited by Greg Vriethoff; 12-06-2019 at 11:50 AM. Reason: gramammar
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Old 12-06-2019, 12:19 PM
Shawn Everette Shawn Everette is offline
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What Greg said, https://www.us.schott.com/epackaging...er/solder.html. Most are lead based, but some are lead free, melt 800-1000*.

I wonder if the stuff was failing because of compatibility issues. The powders are all over the board, and it's not designed to mate different coe's. I'll make sure to reach out to those guys. Ed's teaching a class at PGC on it, but of course it has to be the same week my visiting artist is coming.
Here's an blog on someone doing some testing with it. A decent methodology, but some of the conclusions seem odd.
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Old 12-06-2019, 12:22 PM
Steven O'Day Steven O'Day is offline
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You could try a stained glass enamel known as soft flux or a clear enamel. I used to use it to gloss sand blasted surfaces. My understanding of glass solder is that the compatibility of the two glasses and the glass solder need to be dead on.

Reusche was recently bought by Schilling https://www.schillinginc.com/inks-coatings.aspx no idea how they are to deal with.
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Old 12-06-2019, 05:52 PM
Tom Fuhrman Tom Fuhrman is offline
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Ed was using all types of different glasses together. He even used machine pressed and blown glass with all kinds of other glass. He gave some good presentations on his technique at some of the GAS conferences. I'm not sure where I put my notes from those.
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Old 12-06-2019, 06:57 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Shawn Everette View Post
I wonder if the stuff was failing because of compatibility issues. The powders are all over the board, and it's not designed to mate different coe's.
At one point we (the glass program) obtained a large amount of lead-based neon tubing. As I recall it was a donation. It was decided we'd experiment with using it as a cheap cullet for kiln casting. I remember mashing a bunch of that stuff up with a slap dash crusher we put together. I did wear a respirator, but I still wonder how much lead I managed to ingest.

As far as C.O.E./L.E.C./whatever, I guess that was as close as you could get since the electrodes were obtained from the same supplier.

Still a mystery (to me) as to why those early experiments failed. Jason managed to get to a point where he could make reliable plasma units. From what I remember he told me the failures were more often with power supplies. Those are most common components to crap-out in a neon system. They start buzzing louder and louder before they fail. Kinda like a ballast in a florescent light fixture. He was getting too many calls from galleries and clients asking for repairs. I'll go out on a limb and assume he was using cheaper components as well.
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Old 12-07-2019, 07:44 AM
David Schimmel David Schimmel is offline
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SCHOTT Electronic Packaging

Email kevin.waxman@us.schott.com. He can point you in the right direction.
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Old 12-07-2019, 10:26 AM
Shawn Everette Shawn Everette is offline
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That old leaded stuff was beautiful to bend with if your flame was right. I was more worried about students near the bombarder than the lead.

From what I've seen the coe's need to be pretty close for the mating pieces, as well as the solder. It's used industrially for a variety of applications, so I think once you get it dialed in it should be fine.

Cheap transformers are a bane, pay the money and raise the price. At one point I had figured out how to hack a cfl to run 5' of tube, they didn't last long. If I really get in the weeds on this I'm going to look for a way to make a transformer swap easier, most of the stuff I'm thinking about would be proximity lit anyway. Tech 22 had some great field generators.
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Old 12-07-2019, 10:28 AM
Shawn Everette Shawn Everette is offline
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That's why I'm bummed I can't take the class. Did he do the presentation at Norfolk? Can't find my notes either.
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Old 12-07-2019, 10:31 AM
Shawn Everette Shawn Everette is offline
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Awesome, thank you!
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