CraftWEB Hot Glass Talk  

Go Back   CraftWEB Hot Glass Talk > Hot Glass > General Hot Glass Discussion

Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
  #1  
Old 12-28-2017, 10:38 PM
Philip Yamron Philip Yamron is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jul 2012
Location: Ann Arbor, MI
Posts: 43
Philip Yamron is on a distinguished road
Anyone running a Hub Consolidated Furnace?

I'm lined up to purchase a used 300# Hub consolidated furnace. (Sold off our 150# electroglass furnace) it has a 400,000 btu eclipse burner. I'm trying to figure out approximately how much it's going to cost me to run. I plan to batch once a week. Using natural gas. Just wondering if anyone had any insight and or if anyone knows a formula for this. Thanks and Happy New Year!
Reply With Quote
  #2  
Old 12-29-2017, 12:37 AM
Eben Horton Eben Horton is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Apr 2002
Location: Wakefield, RI
Posts: 4,043
Eben Horton is on a distinguished road
I run a mu 300. My gas bill is around $700 a month for the furnace, pipewarmer and 18 g-hole
Reply With Quote
  #3  
Old 12-29-2017, 08:04 AM
Pete VanderLaan's Avatar
Pete VanderLaan Pete VanderLaan is offline
The Old Gaffer
 
Join Date: Apr 2002
Location: Chocorua New Hampshire
Posts: 19,552
Pete VanderLaan is on a distinguished road
If you know your rate per therm, compare that with Eben. .
__________________
Where are we going and why am I in this basket?
Reply With Quote
  #4  
Old 12-29-2017, 02:37 PM
Ron Mynatt Ron Mynatt is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Apr 2008
Location: Springdale Arkansas
Posts: 127
Ron Mynatt is on a distinguished road
I used 635 ccf last month for the 300, pipe warmer and a 21" ribbon burner glory hole. Total bill was 654.80
Reply With Quote
  #5  
Old 12-29-2017, 06:37 PM
Philip Yamron Philip Yamron is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jul 2012
Location: Ann Arbor, MI
Posts: 43
Philip Yamron is on a distinguished road
Thanks everyone this info is SUPER helpful!!
Reply With Quote
  #6  
Old 12-30-2017, 08:34 AM
Christopher DeMott Christopher DeMott is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: May 2016
Location: CT
Posts: 11
Christopher DeMott is on a distinguished road
We run a 400#, pipe warmer/garage, 16" hole and melt once a week and we're around $500 a month.
Reply With Quote
  #7  
Old 12-30-2017, 12:28 PM
Ron Mynatt Ron Mynatt is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Apr 2008
Location: Springdale Arkansas
Posts: 127
Ron Mynatt is on a distinguished road
I have a recuperater that helps cut down on lost heat.I think that is a good investment, just be sure to clean it out ever so often.
Reply With Quote
  #8  
Old 12-30-2017, 01:28 PM
Eben Horton Eben Horton is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Apr 2002
Location: Wakefield, RI
Posts: 4,043
Eben Horton is on a distinguished road
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ron Mynatt View Post
I have a recuperater that helps cut down on lost heat.I think that is a good investment, just be sure to clean it out ever so often.
Same here.. Id prefer a correll one though.
Reply With Quote
  #9  
Old 01-02-2018, 04:47 PM
Scott Novota's Avatar
Scott Novota Scott Novota is offline
AbbyNormal User
 
Join Date: Jan 2004
Location: Pensacola Florida
Posts: 2,083
Scott Novota is on a distinguished road
wow...man I really might need to get a gas furnace. My electrical bill would shock you guys.
Reply With Quote
  #10  
Old 01-02-2018, 05:10 PM
Pete VanderLaan's Avatar
Pete VanderLaan Pete VanderLaan is offline
The Old Gaffer
 
Join Date: Apr 2002
Location: Chocorua New Hampshire
Posts: 19,552
Pete VanderLaan is on a distinguished road
I had to bail on the stadleman when I went to 2200 bucks a month. In propane, I'm back down in the $750 range which won't last and it's not recuperated. We have a Correll recuperator I've never installed and don't think we will on this little unit but it's right there, brand new for the next furnace.

Eric and I have to see what the next year yields as demand.

So Steve's furnace is at the door and ready to take it outside. We need the space. Smaller glory hole, fumer and a redesigned annealer. I'm an old guy and don't need a lot at this point. Right now, electric is not the answer but the insurance is probably better.
__________________
Where are we going and why am I in this basket?
Reply With Quote
  #11  
Old 01-03-2018, 10:50 AM
Ron Mynatt Ron Mynatt is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Apr 2008
Location: Springdale Arkansas
Posts: 127
Ron Mynatt is on a distinguished road
Pete, your fumer you mentioned how are you picking up the stannous and what is the exhaust blower ?
Reply With Quote
  #12  
Old 01-03-2018, 12:15 PM
Pete VanderLaan's Avatar
Pete VanderLaan Pete VanderLaan is offline
The Old Gaffer
 
Join Date: Apr 2002
Location: Chocorua New Hampshire
Posts: 19,552
Pete VanderLaan is on a distinguished road
I mix the tin in a jar that holds about one pint of isopropyl alcohol, sometimes I use hydrochloric acid but it makes little difference. I have an aquarium stone in the mix to keep it stirred. It's drawn from the jar through a tube with an eye dropper with an air jet behind it ( A venturi). The air is controlled through a foot valve with a solenoid. We use a new heavy metal barrel we got from Uline. It is liberally coated with rustoleum. There's sand in the bottom.

The blower is never big. The whole unit is in the hood. If you pull the fumes too fast, it won't fume well. It's best if it just barely hangs out at the front of the fumer before being pulled in and out of the building through a large fan.
__________________
Where are we going and why am I in this basket?
Reply With Quote
  #13  
Old 01-03-2018, 12:39 PM
Rick Wilton Rick Wilton is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Oct 2005
Location: Calgary, Alberta Canada
Posts: 181
Rick Wilton is on a distinguished road
what are you guys per kWh our rates have gone done and are currently around 3-4 cents kWh. in Alberta Canada
Reply With Quote
  #14  
Old 01-03-2018, 01:36 PM
Jordan Kube Jordan Kube is offline
?
 
Join Date: Aug 2003
Location: Seattle, WA
Posts: 1,541
Jordan Kube is on a distinguished road
Quote:
Originally Posted by Pete VanderLaan View Post
I mix the tin in a jar that holds about one pint of isopropyl alcohol, sometimes I use hydrochloric acid but it makes little difference. I have an aquarium stone in the mix to keep it stirred. It's drawn from the jar through a tube with an eye dropper with an air jet behind it ( A venturi). The air is controlled through a foot valve with a solenoid. We use a new heavy metal barrel we got from Uline. It is liberally coated with rustoleum. There's sand in the bottom.

The blower is never big. The whole unit is in the hood. If you pull the fumes too fast, it won't fume well. It's best if it just barely hangs out at the front of the fumer before being pulled in and out of the building through a large fan.
Mick Owen built a really cool barrel inside a barrel design. The large barrel had the fan attached and the small "spray" barrel was set inside. You got all the spray and anything that came out was sucked away inside the larger barrel. I say barrel but the thing wasn't gigantic or anything. Worked really well.
__________________
WWUD? Think for yourself.
Reply With Quote
  #15  
Old 01-03-2018, 04:00 PM
Pete VanderLaan's Avatar
Pete VanderLaan Pete VanderLaan is offline
The Old Gaffer
 
Join Date: Apr 2002
Location: Chocorua New Hampshire
Posts: 19,552
Pete VanderLaan is on a distinguished road
Quote:
Originally Posted by Rick Wilton View Post
what are you guys per kWh our rates have gone done and are currently around 3-4 cents kWh. in Alberta Canada
The KWH rate has gotten pretty bad at around 10.5 but our real issue is the off KW costs.
Right now, I'm actually not hot. It has been really cold in the shop and I have used an open annealer to help keep the pipes warm enough. I got an electric bill last week and the KW charge was about $230 bucks. The delivery charge was on the other $240.00

Any time these comparisons are made, they rarely work. You have to consider so many variables. In the thread on gas cost, no consideration is being made for frequency of charge, blah blah , blah: You can't compare until you really compare,
__________________
Where are we going and why am I in this basket?
Reply With Quote
  #16  
Old 01-03-2018, 04:19 PM
Pete VanderLaan's Avatar
Pete VanderLaan Pete VanderLaan is offline
The Old Gaffer
 
Join Date: Apr 2002
Location: Chocorua New Hampshire
Posts: 19,552
Pete VanderLaan is on a distinguished road
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jordan Kube View Post
Mick Owen built a really cool barrel inside a barrel design. The large barrel had the fan attached and the small "spray" barrel was set inside. You got all the spray and anything that came out was sucked away inside the larger barrel. I say barrel but the thing wasn't gigantic or anything. Worked really well.
************
Fuming is interesting and rarely is it discussed how much the basic glass composition has to do with a good fume... It actually matters. Temperature is also key on fuming, it too matters.. Reduction matters. Lusters only work on lead base glasses. Reduction on soda limes are gorgeous if the formula is right and of course, commercial clears are not right It either matts out, or ruins a fume or mottles. Don't keep your burner where it hits the piece. That indeed looks like shit.
__________________
Where are we going and why am I in this basket?
Reply With Quote
  #17  
Old 01-04-2018, 04:36 PM
Ron Mynatt Ron Mynatt is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Apr 2008
Location: Springdale Arkansas
Posts: 127
Ron Mynatt is on a distinguished road
Jordan,Is there a picture of the double barrel design.I use a 55 gal plastic pickle barrel with a screw on lid so I can down size the opening but the barrel inside might be a better way to recycle the stannous once it recrystallizes on the wall.I use a Jabsco plastic inline blower to vent off the excess material.
Reply With Quote
  #18  
Old 01-04-2018, 06:58 PM
Pete VanderLaan's Avatar
Pete VanderLaan Pete VanderLaan is offline
The Old Gaffer
 
Join Date: Apr 2002
Location: Chocorua New Hampshire
Posts: 19,552
Pete VanderLaan is on a distinguished road
I'm not all sure of the notion of recycling the Stannous as a good idea. I chuck it.
__________________
Where are we going and why am I in this basket?
Reply With Quote
  #19  
Old 01-04-2018, 08:23 PM
Eben Horton Eben Horton is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Apr 2002
Location: Wakefield, RI
Posts: 4,043
Eben Horton is on a distinguished road
Quote:
Originally Posted by Pete VanderLaan View Post
I'm not all sure of the notion of recycling the Stannous as a good idea. I chuck it.
Do you make your own?
Reply With Quote
  #20  
Old 01-04-2018, 09:29 PM
Ron Mynatt Ron Mynatt is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Apr 2008
Location: Springdale Arkansas
Posts: 127
Ron Mynatt is on a distinguished road
The stannous recrystallizes well in the lower humidity months I cannot tell a difference between fresh crystals and the crystal I pull off the plastic sides of the barrel. Once it hits the higher humidity months March I have found that the stuff is hard to control ratio of tin to acid to alcohol and H2O . As long as I store the residue in sealed container it works as well as fresh crystal. No I don't make my own . I researched trying to do my own crystals, the tin has gotten too expensive to make it worth the time and effort.
Reply With Quote
  #21  
Old 01-05-2018, 07:31 AM
Pete VanderLaan's Avatar
Pete VanderLaan Pete VanderLaan is offline
The Old Gaffer
 
Join Date: Apr 2002
Location: Chocorua New Hampshire
Posts: 19,552
Pete VanderLaan is on a distinguished road
I have about 120 lbs of the stuff from back when it was $4.25 lb. These days it would probably be worth doing, Back then it wasn't/
__________________
Where are we going and why am I in this basket?
Reply With Quote
  #22  
Old 01-05-2018, 11:35 AM
Ron Mynatt Ron Mynatt is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Apr 2008
Location: Springdale Arkansas
Posts: 127
Ron Mynatt is on a distinguished road
It looks like Tin is around 20.00 per lb but I was able to buy Kenny Piper's supply that he had for much less .Hopefully with recycling my crystals and what I got from him I won't need to buy any more.
Reply With Quote
  #23  
Old 01-05-2018, 02:48 PM
Pete VanderLaan's Avatar
Pete VanderLaan Pete VanderLaan is offline
The Old Gaffer
 
Join Date: Apr 2002
Location: Chocorua New Hampshire
Posts: 19,552
Pete VanderLaan is on a distinguished road
Kenny's came from the Fenton auction. There were some sweet deals to be had on chemicals if you knew what you were looking at.
__________________
Where are we going and why am I in this basket?
Reply With Quote
  #24  
Old 01-05-2018, 05:01 PM
Jordan Kube Jordan Kube is offline
?
 
Join Date: Aug 2003
Location: Seattle, WA
Posts: 1,541
Jordan Kube is on a distinguished road
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ron Mynatt View Post
Jordan,Is there a picture of the double barrel design.I use a 55 gal plastic pickle barrel with a screw on lid so I can down size the opening but the barrel inside might be a better way to recycle the stannous once it recrystallizes on the wall.I use a Jabsco plastic inline blower to vent off the excess material.
Ron, I do not have a picture but if you are already using a 55 gallon drum it would be a simple thing to put a slightly smaller drum inside and hook up your sprayer to it. A little tinkering should get you where you want to be. Inset the inner barrel from the lip of the larger barrel 8-12" so everything gets captured. You'll have to play with it. It worked really well.
__________________
WWUD? Think for yourself.
Reply With Quote
  #25  
Old 01-31-2018, 10:28 AM
Eben Horton Eben Horton is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Apr 2002
Location: Wakefield, RI
Posts: 4,043
Eben Horton is on a distinguished road
just paid some bills- my studio used 575 terms in December for a total Gas cost of $300. Delivery charges were a little over $300 with a total payment of $725.

Electricity for the entire shop was $410.


my mind is blown every time i think back to when I was sucking off the propane tank at $1800 to $2000 a month..
__________________
<eben epoiese>
Reply With Quote
Reply


Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is Off
HTML code is Off
Forum Jump


All times are GMT -5. The time now is 04:01 AM.


All published comments within these message boards are the opinions of its contributor and does not represent
the opinion(s) of the owner(s) of this website. Please see the Terms of Use file for more details.

Books to Help Artists Avoid Online Scams: Top 10 Email Scams | Social Media Scams

Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.7.2
Copyright ©2000 - 2018, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
CraftWEB.com. Opportunity Network. 2008. All Rights Reserved.