Yesterday

[Pete VanderLaan]

What I witnessed was an insurrection led by Donald Trump. I think he should be impeached, today, tried, convicted, indicted and found guilty of sedition at the least by the dept of justice..

Tell me your thoughts.

[Eben Horton]

I agree.
But I wonder if he wants this so pence can pardon him. Perhaps the strategy is to run out the clock so he can be fully convicted ?

I’d love to see all of his kids in jail too. Plus his wife Melanoma. Maybe her orange jumpsuit can say “I don’t care. Do you?” On the back of it.

[Ed Pennebaker]

Agreed. How can law enforcement allow armed gunmen into the Capitol building and back out with no arrests or confrontations? I haven't watched a lot of video of this but there seemed to be little to no resistance, a planned coup. Stood down and stood by.

[Tom Fuhrman]

Things need to change today, a lot more damage can be done in the coming 2 weeks.

[Michael Ahlefeldt-Laurvig]

Lets move this to cords and strings please

[Michael Egan]

Hey Pete! What are your thoughts about this? I am always thinking about the colloidal suspension that is gold ruby glass.... how does that idea feel about this new idea?


https://www.popularmechanics.com/sci...-liquid-glass/

[Michael Ahlefeldt-Laurvig]

This is actually a new thread Michael- make it such

[Pete VanderLaan]

No, I don't want to move it. The cords board is not open to visitors which I think you know. I want it out in the larger community to reflect on.

This entire culmination is based on lying. Since last May, we have been fed the future notion that the only way Trump could lose the election was by fraud. That was untrue then and is untrue today. It is a manipulative fraud brought by Trump using Twitter and facebook which did not require truth in posting.

In all 62 cases brought before the courts there was never a single mention of fraud and for good reason; the lawyers could all be sanctioned by the courts for presenting material that could not be supported, in any way , by evidence. Outside, however they were unfettered by standards of the law and could, and did say anything they wished to and they did it for the next six months.
All 62 cases were dismissed with scathing critiques of the attempts.

Trump always said he loved his low information voters. That's an actual quote. He really does stand to be ruined as soon as he is no longer president so his motivating acts that try to block his loss are upfront. He incited an insurrection that so far has failed. I don't necessarily think its over. I think he should be removed immediately and I don't think at this point that Pence is a fool enough to try to help him.

We are , or are supposed to be a democracy. We can take time out from making glass to consider, with each other how valuable that democracy is, so no, it isn't going under table. This has caused enormous damage. This guy has the nuclear codes and is totally unfit.

[Marty Kremer]

I have a fantasy that the nuclear codes that have followed him around for the last 4 years are bogus, swapped out by straight thinking members of his staff.

It makes me feel better....

What also makes me feel better is writing to Susan (he learned his lesson) Collins and my other reps demanding immediate impeachment etc.

[Michael Ahlefeldt-Laurvig]

Well Pete in that case I dont think many will speak out.
The rest of the world thinks its insane.
Its high treason in most countries, what he did
What about the almost half americans thar votet for him - 74 mlliion? Are they stupid or crazy too?

[Pete VanderLaan]

Most are mainstream republicans who vote party not ideology of the individual. They really hated Clinton who ran a crappy campaign. But you might look at it this way:

Trump in 2016 had control over the house, the senate and the presidency. The house was lost to the GOP in the single greatest turnover seen in the house ever.
Then Trump lost the presidency in November by seven million votes. This election was actually not even particularly close. 2000, 2004 and 2016 were far closer.
Then he went into his conspiracy mode full time and told Georgia voters this election would be rigged, tried to have the Sec of State there manufacture votes and simply to announce a reassessment of the vote. That became a public tape for which he could also be indicted for.
But, add it up, he helped Georgia to flip the senate. GOP turnout there was down 13% from November. Great job.

I am awaiting the collective wisdom on what to do about him. They really can't do nothing. I don't think they will wait fourteen days. It is likely easier to use the 25th amendment than to impeach but I suspect that events demand action.

He leads a cult Michael, not unlike Jim Jones in Guyana. I'd like to see Jim Mattis be correct in saying he will be a man with out a country. Take his children with him. Even Bill Barr is on the side of justice. Pence is furious. McConnell has just been demoted. Even Lindsey Graham has bailed. Being where you are, you can't see the tide rising against him as I type.

[Pete VanderLaan]

Originally Posted by Michael Ahlefeldt-Laurvig

Well Pete in that case I dont think many will speak out.
The rest of the world thinks its insane.
Its high treason in most countries, what he did
What about the almost half americans thar votet for him - 74 mlliion? Are they stupid or crazy too?

*****
He got 46 percent. In this country that's a long way from half. Most are actually not unhappy to see him go.

[Michael Ahlefeldt-Laurvig]

So after the 25000 lies and absurd behavior every day during the last 4 years 74 million still see him fit to be president?

[Michael Ahlefeldt-Laurvig]

Actually I dont see 46% far from half

[Marty Kremer]

Unfortunately, yes.
They failed math in school, they failed civics (if it was even taught), they failed science. They live no further than their entertainments and entitlements. They're resentful, they're used to coasting on their presumed privileges, and they can see those privileges being shared with the "others" and they're afraid that there won't be enough for them. They need someone to look down on to feel better about themselves.
They see no further than their own immediate concerns- Why should I pay school taxes? I don't have kids in school anymore.
They're selfish and self-righteous and there have always been enough 'leaders' to congratulate them on their views.

[Pete VanderLaan]

Originally Posted by Michael Ahlefeldt-Laurvig

Actually I dont see 46% far from half

****
We're a nation of 330 million people. 74 million voted for Trump. Our electoral turnout is always notoriously low. Biden received 81 million votes. In 2000, Bush received 550 votes more than Gore did in Florida. As is the case in our primary elections, only the most fired up actually vote ever. Our primaries are a major problem since only the most rabid vote at all and they are usually at the extreme ends of the political spectrum. It's not that difficult to win a primary but then the election becomes larger in scope. Our real problem there is gerrymandering districts so that status can become bulletproof which in turn allows for really crazy positions to form. It's not true of the senate. Those are statewide elections. Even so, the deep south is still the deep south and still chaffs at the civil rights act of 64. So to lose Georgia was really a major loss.

[Pete VanderLaan]

Originally Posted by Michael Ahlefeldt-Laurvig

So after the 25000 lies and absurd behavior every day during the last 4 years 74 million still see him fit to be president?

***
They loved his racissm. They loved his wall. They loved his tariffs on China.

[Michael Ahlefeldt-Laurvig]

Bloody hell, I think Ill pull out here

[Greg Vriethoff]

It's unfortunate we let things get this bad.

The nightmare scenario I've had playing out in my head for a while is him fleeing to the WH bunker and threatening the entire world with our nuclear arsenal. He's a cornered animal, and there's no telling what he will do. For all of you that immediately think "That's crazy. That could never happen." Think about yesterday. Think about how many times over the last five years we've had to pick our jaws up off the floor.

I won't rest easy and call any of this "over" until they kick his ass out and change the locks. I will be on edge for the next 13 days.

My fantasy vision of justice would be him and everyone in his orbit be tried for treason, convicted, sentenced to death, and a public execution held. This is where we're at. I am normally anti-death penalty, but desperate times call for desperate measures.

In reality, I would like to see at least a trial. We all know the pardons will continue to come. How many high-ranking officials have we seen over the last fifty years do any time? Zero.

He's going to walk away from this. Yes, the pardon will only be for Federal crimes. I have little to no faith the state of NY will do anything.

Do you realize how bad it would look to the rest of the world to have a former President in jail?

The Democrats don't have the guts to go after him(them). We've already heard Biden saying it's time to "heal the nation." The same bs we hear every time there's a school shooting "Now is not the time for politics. Our thoughts and prayers go out to the families. We need to heal... blah,blah,blah."

[Michael Ahlefeldt-Laurvig]

I get it Pete, its a shame

[Pete VanderLaan]

the primary reason that Agnew was allowed to simply resign as VP in 1973 was the realization that if Nixon did in fact quit, that Agnew would become the president and the evidence that he was soliciting bribes openly was going to make him president.

[Brice Turnbull]

While I am utterly disgusted at what happened yesterday, I am actually glad it happened where it did, and brought the reality of not only Trump's damaging invitation to sedition and violence (through all 4.5 years he's been on the political scene) but also the reality of so many other legislators' stoking Right To Their Own Faces. No more pretending they aren't aware of what they are stoking.

Much better it happen there, live and in person than out on the streets and in the stores, restaurants and churches where it's been only viewed from afar by these thug politicians previously.

Having said that, and while I am concerned that Trump, associated elector-rejecting legislators, and the rioters themselves are not already in custody and awaiting trial, my real concern is that more intelligent and more competent people are and will be watching all of this and noting exactly which actions are rewarded with fans, followers, votes, and money (like the $300 million tax-free, supervision free has been 'donated' to his "legal defense fund" in less than 2 months. Who else knows how to raise a 5-generation worthy fortune in 2 months?). When those people do this with foresight and competency, I have no reason to believe they will be stopped.

No one stopped this riot, no one has yet stopped Trump or his supporters or associated legislators from proceeding. If he wanted to, he could do this again today or tomorrow. It fizzled out only because Trump is not a leader. Had he golf-carted his ass down to the Capitol building with them, he could have shaken hands with the 'security' officers and set up a monkey congress - and would be sitting there now while get-alongers would be giving interviews with harsh words to newspapers outside, or outside of DC. No one seems at all proportionately responsive to what happened.

Then next one will be much worse.

Didn't we just see this a few months ago at the capitol in Michigan? And look what confidence that gave to these rioters yesterday. Step one. Step two. And what punishment and clear & overwhelming response did we see against the agitators in the legislature and media in Michigan? Nothing significant at all.

It is not hyperbole at this point to recall that the Nazis had a 'failed coup' 10 years before they completed gaining complete power in Germany. The U.S. had a failed coup yesterday only because it lacked a leader. I wish Trump many unhappy returns, but he is old. I don't fear Trump. It was obvious from the start that he has no idea what power was at his fingertips as president. He had no ideas what to do with the resources of the biggest, best funded intelligence, police, and military forces in the history of the world.

I fear the smarter ones who are going to use this as their starting point in the background until they get more organized.

[Pete VanderLaan]

Originally Posted by Michael Ahlefeldt-Laurvig

I get it Pete, its a shame

****
Sometimes you need to get counted. Trump operates like a Mafia crime boss in virtually every way. The GOP has lost its way badly since 2010 where the toxicity really took hold. John Boehner, at the time of his resignation in 2015 said "The party of Lincoln has gone off to take a nap". He observed this morning that it turned into a nightmare.

Tiny children in cages? There are good Nazi's? Mexicans are rapists? This was approved of by the bulk of the GOP or at the least was not rejected.

I see a country shaking off this slumber and I'm glad to see it. We need accountability as a nation of laws. We won't get it if we hide in the dark. He has 13 days left. He can do remarkable damage in that time. We are still a very racist nation. In 1960, black men earned 51 cents on every dollar compared to white males . The number today? .51 cents. Don't kid yourself.

[Rich Samuel]

Can he pardon entire groups? I picture him pardoning everyone convicted and/or imprisoned on federal charges, essentially emptying the dockets and the federal prisons. He'd probably issue it ten minutes before Biden is sworn in.

[Rosanna Gusler]

I am just glad that he is really as stupid as he is.