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Old 08-01-2017, 05:11 PM
Josh Bernbaum Josh Bernbaum is offline
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Insurance for shipping

So this may sound like a newb. question even though I've been shipping and insuring my work (first with UPS and now with USPS) for years. I've always paid extra for their insurance in addition to the shipping fees, but as my prices slowly go up it's been getting kinda expensive to insure for what will be the full retail price of the piece at whatever gallery. Since I'm consigning, and only get half of the sale price usually, I'm wondering what your collective thoughts are on just insuring for the wholesale price (or my part of the sale if/when it sells). If it breaks in the mail and USPS doesn't try to weasel out of it, then theoretically the money I would have gotten from a sale would be covered. But if the piece breaks in the mail then it never gets seen by public/gets into someone's collection/whatever so there is that loss too which may be part of this equation. I always double box, which I think is #1 best insurance, but again just curious to hear what you folks do vis a vis insurance when shipping. Thanks in advance, love Craftweb, etc..
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Old 08-01-2017, 05:42 PM
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Barb Sanderson Barb Sanderson is offline
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I always always insured (and double boxed, foam, etc.). USPS has an insurance "system" whereby they usually will deny the claim unless you have all your ducks in a row. I would insure for the full retail price and if something broke I would send USPS an invoice which wasn't "real" (ie consignment price) to show the true value of the piece. Oh and of course they require pictures of the broken glass AND mangled box as well. If you get all those things to them they usually were good about paying up.
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Old 08-01-2017, 06:54 PM
Art Freas Art Freas is online now
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Run screaming from FED EX has been my experience.
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Old 08-01-2017, 08:32 PM
Ron Mynatt Ron Mynatt is offline
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The problem I have with the Post Office is the shipping charge.It will not be refunded if they break it .Their idea is that unless they lose it between Ark and Kauai they will not pay the shipping charges.If it is damaged at least they got the box to the gallery. I have decided to insure it for full retail and that way I have covered the shipping charge.
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Old 08-01-2017, 09:51 PM
Eben Horton Eben Horton is offline
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The best thing I ever did was to stop using bubble wrap. I use foam in a roll now and it's so good, I stopped paying for insurance. Double box, cardboard dividers between pieces, lots of that biodegradable corn based peanuts and zero loss now.
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Old 08-01-2017, 09:51 PM
Marty Kremer Marty Kremer is offline
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Insure for full retail- the difference isn't that great.
If you're consigning, build the shipping and insurance into your wholesale price.
And double box etc.
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Old 08-01-2017, 11:03 PM
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David Patchen David Patchen is online now
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I stopped insuring probably a dozen years ago since it seemed like a huge waste of money--nothing ever broke. And when I did have a gallery return something to me and it arrived broken the claims process took forever (even though it was on them), but that was further disincentive for me to insure if I'm packing.

I pack *really* well with only minimal bubble wrap and peanuts but everything is super tight and under compression so the glass is immobile. I baffle all sides (same as double-boxing) so the glass could never reach the edge of the box since there's a cardboard baffle next to the glass, then many inches of peanuts before the edge of the box. I assume it will fall off a FedEx truck and I pack for that possibility.

I'd rather spend a few extra dollars on packing really well than $30+ for insurance that would be hell to collect on if the worst happened.
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Old 08-02-2017, 07:37 AM
Josh Bernbaum Josh Bernbaum is offline
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Thanks for all those replies. I can't really argue against packing super well being the best insurance, but what if USPS (or whatever shipping company) loses the box entirely? Maybe it's a better question for them, but do you think insurance could be valuable in that instance?
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Old 08-02-2017, 09:57 AM
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You have to weigh the costs of always insuring your pieces, and the improbable chance of the loss of a box. Granted, I don't have very expensive pieces, but, I figured out that the claims that I made over the years compared to actual losses was costing me major bucks by insuring everything. If something is damaged, I get up to $100 from the "free" insurance. IF I have a larger piece that is in its own box, I may take our the extra buck or two for the insurance. Everything that we shipped is wrapped in paper, small bubble, cardboard dividers, inside foam lined boxes. My UPS rep loves our packing, and even if UPS rejects a claim, my rep will overturn it
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Old 08-02-2017, 02:17 PM
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Pete VanderLaan Pete VanderLaan is offline
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Your best insurance is to pack really well and I can't stress that enough. UPS has an interesting denial approach which says essentially, first, it's not insurance and then if it broke in a single box, or even a double, you proabably didn't pack well enough so the claim is denied. Then, if you packed in accordance with their directions, the piece was damaged before it was put in the box and they won't pay. . It's Called Crawford Insurance and the role in life is to deny everything. You will do better if you can show a consistent shipping record with success. Holes in boxes, crushed boxes, all that are maybe yes maybe no. You will be denied on your first attempt and you need a field representative. Break more than a few things in a blue moon and they will not accept the package.

Most of them will only pay actual replacement cost, not retail.

USPS HAS ALWAYS SEEMED TO ME LIKE A CRAP SHOOT. Fed Ex will not insure Art, period.
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Old 08-02-2017, 02:50 PM
Charles Friedman Charles Friedman is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Eben Horton View Post
The best thing I ever did was to stop using bubble wrap. I use foam in a roll now and it's so good, I stopped paying for insurance. Double box, cardboard dividers between pieces, lots of that biodegradable corn based peanuts and zero loss now.
I agree with Eben. Use foam and change densities. Harder foam closer to the outside. Use cardboard divers. Make it difficult for a shock wave to travel directly thru the box to the glass. I stopped paying for insurance many years ago.
There is a technique called cavity packing. Cut foam to shape, look it up.

Don't be greedy or skimp on packing materials, that's your insurance money.
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Old 08-02-2017, 04:21 PM
Kenny Pieper Kenny Pieper is offline
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I use u.p.s. almost exclusively and insure everything for my price for the pieces. The cost of shipping and insurance gets charged to the gallery and then eventually to the customer. I know it can substantially raise the final price but it is worth it to me. I have had boxes mangled and sometimes with thousands of dollars worth of work. I have seen some pictures of my boxes that look like a fork lift fork went all the way through the thing.

I have never had a claim denied in the end but there is always a denial in the beginning. It is important to follow the u.p.s. guidelines for the packing.

Last year I shipped a somewhat expensive piece and it was broken. The outer box was in an awful shape. We made a claim and the first response was that the box was not rated for the weight of the piece. This was after they examined the packing. Pictures were taken and there clearly was a stamp from the manufacture of the box and I was within the rating of the box. In the end they payed.

Rarely is there a problem but once a year or so I have something broken. Over the years it adds up. I am not willing to lose that much money.
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Old 08-02-2017, 04:48 PM
Eben Horton Eben Horton is offline
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Ups will try and come up with every excuse that they can possibly come up with to get out of paying for insurance. It's a joke
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Old 08-02-2017, 09:16 PM
Ron Mynatt Ron Mynatt is offline
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I ship Fedex ground and they have always paid my claims except when a gallery forgot to let me know right away .They also forgot to take pictures and threw the glass away because they were afraid a employee might get cut.That is why I always bill insurance to the customer, if its damaged I handle the claim and replace it right away.If you use white foam wrap check with your local overhead door company they are happy to give large quantities of this stuff away since all of their doors come wrapped in it.
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Old 08-02-2017, 11:14 PM
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Rich Samuel Rich Samuel is online now
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Next time you need to make a claim, throw some impressive facts and vocabulary at them.

http://www.conservation-design.com/n...rtpacking.html
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