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Old 08-07-2019, 06:41 PM
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Top gathering electric furnace door

The ideal situation is to have your door and maintenance lid close with no space between.
So how bad is a little space? Say 1/8. Thinking about laying a thin layer of fiber In the space.
Franklin
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Old 08-07-2019, 06:41 PM
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Sorry pic rotated for itself
Franklin
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Old 08-07-2019, 07:35 PM
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Since there is no outgas from electric, the goal is to stay airtight as much as ossible or it costs fuel.

That being said, outgas from your cullet may be an issue requiring venting. I don't know how you handle that.
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Old 08-07-2019, 09:00 PM
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I think Charles F had a small plug he used to vent then he would plug it up.
I never had to vent with my small pot. I was more concerned about loosing heat.
Franklin
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Old 08-08-2019, 09:50 AM
Shawn Everette Shawn Everette is online now
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The other thing you've got to watch out for is drippage. Most top gather pots don't retain enough heat to get the gather to trail off and you end up with a bunch of glass around the port that can easily glue your door shut.

If your glass has any boric you'll definitely need to vent or it will find a way out itself.
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Old 08-08-2019, 11:58 AM
Rick Kellner Rick Kellner is offline
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The Mark Lauckner wire melter construction DVD describes an ideal configuration for what you are trying to accomplish, including features that will prevent an air gap from forming in the event that your crucibles settles a bit on a pile of grog, etc. Definitely seems like it might be more resistant to glass attack from gathering, compared to what I am seeing in your photo so far.
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Old 08-08-2019, 03:25 PM
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Richard H used a maintenance lid. I will try some fiber board as a gasket until I redo the top. I looked at a commercial unit to see if I can maximize my gathering size. Very difficult with top gather.
I used a counter weight on the door to help relieve the pressure of the door on the lid.
Any comments on working the furnace with a little space under the lid?
Have to be extra careful of the glass dripping.
Franklin
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Old 08-08-2019, 08:55 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Franklin Sankar View Post
Richard H used a maintenance lid. I will try some fiber board as a gasket until I redo the top. I looked at a commercial unit to see if I can maximize my gathering size. Very difficult with top gather.
I used a counter weight on the door to help relieve the pressure of the door on the lid.
Any comments on working the furnace with a little space under the lid?
Have to be extra careful of the glass dripping.
Franklin
The maintenance lid is part of Mark Lauckner's design for the 40lb unit. What I did was cut the opening larger, then build a 45deg gathering port out of rammable so I could gather more easily.

The glass drippings will eat away the bricks very quickly, which is another reason I built the port out of rammable. Many years later and it's still in perfect shape.
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Old 08-09-2019, 09:58 AM
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Thanks for the reply. How about if I plaster the bricks with a high temp refractory cement.
No ramable here. Did the angle help you to make larger gathers?
Franklin

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Old 08-09-2019, 11:41 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Franklin Sankar View Post
Thanks for the reply. How about if I plaster the bricks with a high temp refractory cement.
No ramable here. Did the angle help you to make larger gathers?
Franklin
I use diluted refractory cement as a 'wash' on all bricks that are exposed to the full heat, like the entire maintenance door and the top door bricks. I also coat the rim of the alumina board that surrounds the crucible and separates the hot chamber from the rest of the furnace. SO far it's done the job of protecting the bricks very well.

My full strength refractory cement was very thick, which is why I thinned it.

As for the gathering port, yes - I did it because I learned on side-gather furnaces and was not getting decent gathers on the "pure vertical" port. Mark does it really well on his video, but he uses smaller pipes and does smaller gathers. I just never got the hang of vertical so modified the port to let me gather "my way".
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Old 08-09-2019, 03:06 PM
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A wash works fine. If you actually plaster the brick, it peels off in large flakes.
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Old 08-09-2019, 05:14 PM
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Wash flakes off and will end up in your pot if you use it in the wrong place.
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Old 08-10-2019, 08:02 AM
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I feel better now that I am learning that others have difficulty with the vertical gathering. Thanks
Franklin
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Old 08-10-2019, 08:05 AM
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Sky do you do vertical gathers?
Franklin
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Old 08-10-2019, 11:33 AM
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I built a few small gas furnaces that hold two pots each with a rolling lids. These were just for color cullet. Iíll be honest Iím not a fan but itís what you do with the glass on the pipe not the way you get it on there.
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Old 08-10-2019, 11:39 AM
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Straight up and down gathering produces some remarkable effects in Chalcedonia glasses.
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Old 08-10-2019, 02:54 PM
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. Vertical gathering has it challenges. Gas furnaces seem to be much better.
If I want to do a front door with electric I will most likely have to almost double my wattage.
Thanks
Franklin
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Old 08-12-2019, 11:08 AM
Shawn Everette Shawn Everette is online now
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Generically the problem with electric is that many are made with the peak wattage for a near ideal environment, e.g. the door is closed. They have a harder time handling the recoup from the heat loss when the door is opened. My experience with the Stadleman's was an exception, and most of the good molys are probably the same. Then there is also the thing of many of them having safety shutoffs so you don't electrocute yourself when gathering, amplifying that heat loss.

Many gas furnaces are going to have burners that run at 5-15% idle, and then have the rest of that capacity to boost the btu's when the door is opened. If you've got your mixer tuned right, you don't have to worry about the dragons breath when trying to gather.
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Old 08-12-2019, 05:16 PM
Tom Fuhrman Tom Fuhrman is offline
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Shawn, you have to be aware that in Trinidad getting materials and doing anything that is not "mainstream" is difficult. Even having anything shipped there is very expensive and difficult. Franklin has built his furnace and it is a wire melter that is probably in it's 3rd or 4th incarnation. Running a gas furnace where he is located would be prohibitively expensive. Even when I have hand delivered items to him it was not easy dealing with some of the customs officials. If you have a lot of $ and governmental clout you can get things done but otherwise anything to do with glassblowing there is a challenge.
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Old 08-12-2019, 05:25 PM
Shawn Everette Shawn Everette is online now
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I wasn't imagining that he's going to have an easy time getting molys, transformers, and controllers, but rather that in the better supply scenarios there are more robust options available. I'm certainly not trying to coax him beyond his means, just laying the info out there and agreeing that he's got quite a hill to climb.

I hated working out of top load tanks, best advise I can really give on the gather is keep a pair of diamonds handy.
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Old 08-12-2019, 05:47 PM
Tom Fuhrman Tom Fuhrman is offline
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He's been working at this a long time and has come a long way. The things we take for granted just aren't the norm in a lot of other parts of the world. Be glad for what you've got. Franklin knows what the possibilities are, but in reality they just aren't in his play book.
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Old 08-13-2019, 10:54 AM
Shawn Everette Shawn Everette is online now
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Yeah, I kind of came to glass at a good time. Hung around enough old school people to learn how to fix stuff, and got to take advantage of the newer tech. The international voices on here do have some real interesting input.
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Old 08-13-2019, 05:18 PM
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True that on the vertical gather on Cal for sure. It looks almost like cane sometimes.
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Old 08-13-2019, 05:19 PM
Eric Trulson Eric Trulson is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Shawn Everette View Post
Yeah, I kind of came to glass at a good time. Hung around enough old school people to learn how to fix stuff, and got to take advantage of the newer tech.
I feel the exact same way. It is very cool to hear about the dry-stacked brick furnaces and the wooden-wheel-on-a-cam homebrew controllers from the 70's & 80's, and learn from the old-timers who came up in a glass world where they had to build and fix everything by themselves. That being said, it's pretty handy to hop online and spend ~$100 and have a ramp/soak PID controller that can run pretty much any type of glass equipment arrive on your doorstep in two days.
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Old 08-13-2019, 06:50 PM
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